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Immigration rally set for Libby Hill
08/16/2013 9:52 AM by John M
An immigration rally hosted by Virginia Organizing and Organizing For Action has been announced for Libby Hill on August 31 at 11AM.
Speakers include Linda Cedillos whose husband was deported 18 months ago while applying for an adjustment of status and Lana Heath de Martinez.
Cant these nuts (BOTH SIDES) protest elsewhere?
Instead of having one thoughtful discussion about the issue, we get two partisan pep rallies. This will really result in a solution…
Rare that I find stuff on DailyKos that I agree with 100% but there was a great comment on the linked thread:
DO NOT BE DECEIVED No one — including our religious leaders — should be deceived.
This is legislation that was written by corporate lobbyists before wrapping as “immigration reform”. And has little to do with human compassion and EVERYTHING to do with profit and GREED.
The Senate legislation enriches corporations and elites while leaving our nation’s middle-class and poor to face DECADES of increased unemployment, declining wages and escalating poverty. FACTS confirmed by the CBO.
This legislation embraces massive increases to both foreign “guest workers” programs and legal immigration — even while citizens OPPOSE by 4-to-1 any such increases. We have an abundance of workers with the skills, education and intelligence for every available job.
Every every corporate meme from “skilled labor shortage”, “1000s of unfilled jobs”, “best and brightest” and “jobs American won’t do” is a proven FALSEHOOD. Our nation needs JOBS — not more workers.
This is a Faustian bargain — with a price much too high for this nation and citizens.
@3 – Agreed. Many people are going to be screwed and most probably don’t know it. Both political parties are shamelessly gaining from any bill at the expense of the rest of us. And don’t worry, it doesn’t matter what citizens say because our government has shown that they consider themselves above the will of the people.
The only way big business can keep generating record profits while Americans continue to maintain our standard of living is to innovate more or to find some magic source of cheap labor. The problem with this is that while it feels good now, eventually these folks aren’t going to want to do these jobs (at this price) either. It’s a fucking pyramid scheme folks.
The only reason why folks from other countries are lining up to do these jobs is because they can get more for that pay when they go home. But is that really right either? What about the folks who stayed in those countries? Now they need to work even harder to keep pace with the higher cost of living that results from the flood of dollars in or uproot their family to keep pace. This is the part we don’t talk about.
Make no mistake, the fault is not with the immigrants who tried to do what was right for their family. It’s with the employers who saw a way to cut corners and save a buck by bringing in folks who would work for less so they don’t need to pay a fair wage.
DC only cares because their donors tell them to.
I’d encourage you guys to de-politicize this a bit, and get to know some families who are actually impacted by this important debate. Lana- one of the rally organizers- is not an angry partisan. She is a young mom, a resident of church hill, a member of my congregation, and is facing a very tough road ahead if some sober-minded reforms are not made. There is space for genuine dialogue about reform to be had. Come out and just talk to some folks.
Corey,
I respectfully beg to differ. This event has already been politicized by being set up by the propaganda arm of the DNC (OFA). I have no doubt Lana’s situation sucks and if there is anything the community can do to help, I’m in. However, whether folks realize it or not this is a sales pitch for a very poorly thought out bill with some useful innocents being enlisted to help sell it. If anyone cares to organize a discussion not affiliated with OFA or Tea party or other polarizing groups, I’d love to attend.
That sounds like a great idea Alex. You seem pretty informed about the issue- perhaps you are the best person to organize a discussion?
Hey Alex, just to let you know, I am not “with” OFA. They have a full time organizer for immigration reform in this region which is why I collaborate with them. If you come you won’t find any angry protesters. You will find a group of humans gathered to share stories and remind our reps that this is a human rights issue that never should have been politicized. I’m not endorsing OFA or any other organization that is part of this collaborative effort, and this event was scheduled long before the Tea Party town hall.
Additionally I agree that the bill sucks. But at the moment it’s my best chance at keeping my family together and out of exile. Hopefully we can do better on the future.
Lastly, I’m not angry at anyone. I am deeply grieving the fact that one group of humans has so easily stripped another group of humans of their humanity. It’s something to mourn for all of us.
Lana,
If you don’t mind me asking, can you share a bit more about your story? Beyond the mentions about some sort of situation above I don’t really know what you are facing here and the backstory.
Also, not to be argumentative, but how exactly is linking up with a propaganda / political group avoiding politicizing the issue?
Regardless of what they may have told you, OFA exists for one reason – to provide support for the Democratic party. They are in this to sell the bill, not to promote deeper discussion.
I’m not accusing you of politicizing anything but am struggling to understand why you don’t feel like they are using your situation for political gain.
This is what I shared at the first rally I spoke at. You can also follow my tumblr for my story and many others: laparedmartinez.tumblr.com
I know exactly why OFA exists and I am not being naively “used”. I also know exactly what is in this legislation. In order to build momentum it is essential to network with established groups that have a considerable base. I get it that OFA is strongly democratic, but here’s the truth: If a Republican or other conservative organization was playing an active role in this debate I would just as quickly link up with them. I can’t build a movement on my own: hence linking up with OFA and Virginia Organizing.
This rally and other events in the area will not be touting Obama’s ideals. It is being put together mainly by people like me. I am my own advocate and the advocate for well over 11 million other families that are facing forced separation or exile. You said if there was any way the community could help, you’d be in. The way you can help is by bringing a non-partisan voice to these events. Crappy or not, this legislation is what is on the table, and it’s better than what we have.
Also, I’d genuinely like to talk to you about any ideas you have for holding non-affiliated events. I don’t know how to do it. You have enough info to look me up via facebook or whatever.
Also, maybe they are using me for political gain, but I am using them equally for personal benefit.
http://youtu.be/ZBZMu1m8EHc?t=2m
Sorry, didn’t know how to post it.
Lana, appreciate the replies. I don’t have any organizing experience either so I’m not exactly sure the best way to get something like this together. Nor am I particularly sure what kind of outcome I’d be looking for from the discussions.
I realize you have a stake in seeing something actually result whereas I’m more interested in this as a search for a best answer to a complex problem (that too often gets oversimplified / politicized). Think something like the old mock UN stuff kids did in high school with a variety of idealogies / perspectives represented trying to come up with a non-partisan solution. The discussion I’m thinking of probably does very little to clear up the immediate concerns you have but I’d love to get your perspective as it’s a valuable one.
Let me do some asking around and see if I can find any suggestions on the best way to structure something like this. I’ll try to make it to the rally and will stick it out until it gets too partisan / pep-rallyish for my taste.
Alex, I think that’s a great idea although you’re right – I need an immediate solution, as do MILLIONS of other families. It would be a really interesting conversation.
It will be great to have you at the rally. I really don’t think you will find it to be a partisan affair – most of the emphasis is on actual families and the bipartisan support that exists for reform (74% of Americans support a pathway to citizenship – and that’s from FOX!!!). At least, none of the events I’ve participated in so far have been heavily politicized. A truly non-partisan voice is always welcome and makes for a better discussion, so I’m really glad you’re willing to participate.
Peace.
I just hope the organizers clean up after themselves. I frankly have grown tired of all the people that use Libby Hill as a small wedding/party venue and then expect someone else will pick up their trash.
What you won’t hear is that it is harder for a US citizen to get Mexican citizenship (or what used to be an FM3) than it is for a Mexican to become a US citizen. Go figure.
And BTW, before you say there should be organized protests in MX, that has been taken care of. In Mexico, if you speak out against the policies of the government, you are subject to immediate deportation.
Lana,
Can you post a source on the Fox survey you quoted above? It looks significantly different than some other numbers I’m seeing and I wanted to try to reconcile whether this was just with the wording of the questions.
For example, the page below has a number of survey results that tell a different story:
https://www.numbersusa.com/content/learn/issues/public-opinion/americans-oppose-amnesty.html
Alex, I will find that source for you, but it was very specific, and not amnesty. It was specifically “pathway to citizenship if they pay back taxes, fines, pass a background check and learn to speak English.” This is a long, expensive and difficult path- certainly not amnesty. But let me to find that link for you…
I just read the link you posted and immediately noticed two things: 1. Americans generally opposed Obama issuing an executive order for DREAMers, not What was in that order; and 2. These surveys are all a couple of years old. As you will see, the poll I referenced is from June or July of this year. Public knowledge of immigration law has increased considerably, resulting in this change.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/06/13/fox-news-poll-voters-want-immigration-reform/
Thanks Lana. Sounds like it’s something similar to the healthcare bill where almost everyone agrees it’s broken but when specifics come up it gets a little dicier.
Personally I think taking some time to solve this right would be ideal (turning off deportation while deciding) but that’s not how Congress works. Their corporate overlords have already written the bill they’d like to see and sent it down with instructions to get it done.
Whenever Congress starts tossing out thousand page bills, you know the result is going to be a shitty mess. By my count, there’s really only a few things that a “comprehensive” bill needs:
1. What to do with the current population who is here without a visa?
2. What level of legal immigration we want going forward?
3. How do we ensure that the border stays secure?
4. What sort of employment verification do we want to require, if any?
If it takes more than a few pages to answer those questions, someone’s doing something wrong.
And I don’t see any reason why these couldn’t be tackled separately beyond the fact that the various factions don’t trust each other enough to get to their part if they agree to wait (employers won’t go for verification unless they know they get more legals added, Red staters won’t go for any relaxing of laws unless we buy a small army for the border, etc.). So we’ll get an awful mishmash that makes nobody happy and answers each of those questions in suboptimal fashion.
BTW, my personal take (very open to change as I learn more about the issue) for those four questions:
1. For anyone who is working, in school, married to a citizen, dependent family member of a legal resident, etc (i.e., generally a productive member of society here) – pay up any back taxes, apply for citizenship through normal channels and be allowed to stay and work while waiting. Otherwise – deportation. No penalty for those here at time of bill being passed but after a grace period, start pushing back citizenship clock for entry without appropriate authorization.
2. I don’t know enough about this to have an answer but I’d think whatever number we have here should be tied to employment levels, economic growth in general and wage levels. If our economy turns around again, we’re going to need more workers. Have fixed quotas like we have had is a mess. Drop the by country crap that we have now and open up the slots equally to all countries.
3. This is already a complete money sink and waste of resources. Use drones to make sure folks aren’t driving tanks / huge trucks of coke across from Mexico and save the rest of the expenses. If folks want to get across they’ll get across.
4. Employers hiring undocumented workers as a way to pay less than market wage will get fined some amount > 1 x the difference of wages paid and market wage. For example, a chicken processing plant that brings in 20 undocumented because they can pay them $5/hr for work that no legal worker would do for less than $15 would need to pay $10 x 20 x number of hours worked x some multiplier. Employers will find ways to take care of compliance really quickly once that is in place.
Congress has had 30 years to come up with something. The fact that they waited so long is their fault, but there is not more time. Obama issued an executive order to use discretion in giving deportations so that only serious criminals get deported but the system has fully disregarded him – that is why it has to be done legislatively.
I’ve been reading a lot lately about how the militarization of the border in the 80’s actually created our crazy problem with immigration. Prior to militarizing the border 47% of undocumented Mexicans returned to their country after a year or two. After militarizing the border that number dropped to 7%.
While I know there are exceptions to this, about 95% of the undocumented immigrants that I know would never have been approved for a visa had they applied to come here “legally”. These same people were the most desperate. They remember growing up without food on the table. They lived in countries where starting your own business means paying off the local cartel to keep your family safe. I believe in the rule of law, but I also believe that we can only uphold laws that are just, and we need to work toward that end.
Lana, are you basically saying that any laws that restrict immigration are unjust and we should allow any non-criminal who wants to come to the US to come? Wouldn’t this put severe downward pressure on wages in this country and make it harder for middle class to survive?
Sort of but it’s not that simple. Anyway it will obviously never happen. Our middle class is rapidly disappearing not because of low income workers but because of abusive corporations. We have one of the highest wealth inequality indices in the world. Honestly, if employers had to pay a higher wage because migrant workers were here legally more Americans would probably take those jobs and fewer people would immigrate to the US due to lower demand. I’m thinking this thread isn’t the best place for this discussion. I look forward to continuing our conversation August 31. You will know who I am because apparently I will be MC-ing the event!
“Our middle class is rapidly disappearing not because of low income workers but because of abusive corporations. We have one of the highest wealth inequality indices in the world. Honestly, if employers had to pay a higher wage because migrant workers were here legally more Americans would probably take those jobs and fewer people would immigrate to the US due to lower demand.”
This is my concern with the immigration issue. From a purely human perspective, I’d love to have open borders. But your last sentence is the problem – corporations want to find a way to exploit this. With a steady flow of folks who are basically forced into indentured servitude until they have citizenship, they can continue to keep downward pressure on wages.
The wealth inequality isn’t the cause, it’s the result. The corporations have been able to abuse and underpay folks because they have a steady pool of people coming who still find $7 an hour with no benefits to be like winning the lottery.
Right now the rules of the game heavily favor one side of the labor supply/demand curve. This is how you get such dramatic inequality. Perhaps the human side of things is compelling enough that we should overlook that this bill will further tip the scales to the corporations. If that’s the case, I’m fine with that argument. But to pretend this is going to have no impact on the shrinking middle class is wishful thinking.
If we’re going to pass this bill, wouldn’t it at least make sense to make it contingent on other countries adopting a similar bill so US workers would have the same freedom to cross borders that our corporations do?
Sent in as a reminder:
Lana,
Can you post a link to the OMB assessment you referenced in your speech at some point? Good speeches today. I had to run before the end but found the part I caught to indeed be respectful and non-partisan. My prayers are with your family.
Alex, I’m really glad you attended and had such a positive response. My work schedule prevented me from attending. Thanks for the post. I look forward to hearing more from others including Lana.
Sorry I’m blanking on OMB?
You made reference to a study showing that the bill would create 3 million jobs in your opening remarks. I thought I heard you say it was from the Congressional Office of Management and Budget (OMB).
Oh the congressional budget office has estimated that this legislation would decrease the federal deficit by over $800 billion within 20 years. 3.2 million new jobs is a number I have seen repeatedly in several different sources, but I will have to search out the actual studies that provide that finding. However, I have been reading a lot about this: http://abcnews.go.com/m/story?id=20007339&ref=http%3A%2F%2Ft.co%2FA3D0TLzBzO Check it out!
Thanks again for being willing to come out and see what we are doing. I’m glad you found it to be non-partisan as promised. Due to the events of the previous night I was really unfocused and exhausted, but I think it went well. We expected about 30 people to attend, but had a total of 75 stop by and sign in.